Basecamping and vulching

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Razgriz_37
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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by Razgriz_37 » 30 Sep 2010 20:24

The airspawn idea could be like sending allied aircraft from a far away base, just like they did with the Big Week Mission for on SOV.
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RCAF_FB_Blood
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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by RCAF_FB_Blood » 30 Sep 2010 20:46

Ok to answer Boomer, Hang's head low and say's yes to that, But only once in all the campains I have flown here. Had to do it once just to see what the hype was about. To the 2 I nailed , I am sorry, Zombie, and hell can't remember the secound I am sorry. Now its not that I haven't tried to do this before but to be honest I allways ended up crashing or breaking my friggin landing gear off :?. Ok anough of that subject.


To the Airspawn thing, it is possable but with one very bad limitation with the DCG, all the bloody base's will be airspawns if the thing is running correctly. I have tried what you guys said about a airspawn in the backfield with the DCG with no or very limited success. I have played with DCG since the old CFS 1, 2 , and 3 days and well its a good program but a finicky bitch at times. With the aaa, I am, of all the guys, most responsable for it the main aaa killer. Sorry life long habit of offline flying on my part leads me to killen the bloody aaa first before much of anything else. If the DCG is set correctly then you best believe there is a lot of aaa, sometimes allmost impossable or suicidel aaa. Make the bloody deathstar look like a raft with bb guns for aaa it can be so bad at times with that program. Also if the DCG is set correctly you actualy have no controle over the location of enemy base's and such. Ok that is all I will say on that as well.


Some say that we have that win at all cost's mentality. Not true in so much as we have a very deversified selection of pilots that fly at defferent times and with diff skill sets. I am on at any time of the day or night do to the fact I have been outa work and layed off now for damn near 2 years and my skill set is more into the heavy fighter or ground attack aircraft area. Yeah I do ok in a fighter but my more or less main area is ground suppression. A area that a lot of pilots don't like do to the short life span expectence of that type of flying and aircraft. Plus we have pilots from all over the world that do this so yeah we have somebody on pretty much at all times.

Ok as a counter to this and this is only a suggestion gentelmen, try and have a good spread of pilots on a side that will have somebody on at any given time of day. This will help negate like in our case the sometimes total and complete air controle do to no enemy pilots on at that given time. Yes I know how hard that may be to do and sounds simple in theory buts in real life its a little harder then it sounds. That is my suggestion guys. Not trying to pick a fight or anything just what I have noticed, ~S~ Blood out

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Python
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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by Python » 30 Sep 2010 21:44

Salute

V ery good Blood and it is very hard to get alot of pilots in during the daytime as most work and don't get on untill late in the evening I can fly most anytime but right now my hard drive is trying to die damn Ibuypower PC not even a year old and things keep going bad on it
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In ancient times skilful warriors first made themselves invincible,
and then watched for vulnerability in their opponents." Sun-Tzu

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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by Python » 30 Sep 2010 21:46

Salute

Ohh one question Blood





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Salute
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In ancient times skilful warriors first made themselves invincible,
and then watched for vulnerability in their opponents." Sun-Tzu

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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by CF23-Seamus » 03 Oct 2010 06:20

Hi all,

First, I didn't mention anyone particular who's responsible for this base camping and vulching. In my personal experience it wasn't any of RCAF! So, it's not just them.

But, I'm sorry, some I just read here is one of the finest BS I've seen yet if you ask me:
RCAF_FB_Bloodshadow wrote:(...) Come on guys we all know its a game and we don't do this as often as I would personaly like, so lets make the best of it and fly. (...)

(...) We will still camp any and all enemy base's if at all possable and we will still vulch the living hell outa any aircraft on the ground, but we will not land bombers there. (...)

(...) Some say that we have that win at all cost's mentality. Not true (...)
YES it is just a game, YES make the best of it and fly. I couldn't agree more on that.
But, you (blues) will continue to
RCAF_FB_Bloodshadow wrote:still camp any and all enemy base's if at all possable and we will still vulch the living hell outa any aircraft on the ground
and then also stating
RCAF_FB_Bloodshadow wrote:we have that win at all cost's mentality. Not true
WHAHAHA You should be in politics! Damn!

You said it yourself "It's just the game and have fun" But tell me, why can it only be fun for YOU and not for US???!!!
Why kill these "hardworking people who wanna spend a few minutes and allow some fun flying after work" don't they deserve that "fun" you are talking about?
If that isn't trying to win at all cost, then what is?

Then some wonder why there isn't/wasn't many reds on... GO FIGURE!!!!

~S
Seamus
~S
CF23-Seamus

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Are we too far gone, are we so irresponsible? Have we lost our balls, or do we just not care?

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RCAF_FB_Under

Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by RCAF_FB_Under » 03 Oct 2010 09:57

S! All.

This has been a problem since the very first map. One side gets upset and the other tries to defend some effective but unfair tactics. It has gone both ways. I have seen a number of posts about this...in fact I have started some because I was upset about it. The parking a bomber at the base thing was really crappy and I was extremely pissed that anyone would resort to a tactic like that when we were winning. I did read the proposed solutions of more AAA and air spawn. More AAA will just mean a little more high altitude bombing and ground attack before their is no more AAA and the base is camped. Even if you put 100 guns there it would eventually be taken out. Not the best solution. Having an air spawn base would not be good either. It would have to be very far away or all would only use the air spawn to get the extra altitude the air spawn would be camped anyway and you would have 5-6 fighters on you without being able to hit refly. There would be more complaining and the cycle would start again under a different thread name. I can see only a few solutions. The first would be to add one or two bases to each side to prevent this, which still might not work but it would be worth a try. Maybe, don't have the ground targets spawn so close to the airfields. This would mean that the bombers and attack planes would need to go to a different area and bombers still would require air cover which would draw off some of the fighters. Remember this is not a dogfight map it is a move the line map which is not done by getting air kills. If you are looking for closed cockpit air to air fighting then go to Skies of Valor or War Birds. The most obvious is just makes the rule of no base camping. I hear all the same reasons why it cant be done. It cant be enforced, this is war and we want it to be realistic, it's a valid tactic.

I know rules can be enforced but since no rules have been made and tried out I guess we will never know. You can say that you don't want to add rules to make it realistic but in real life their are always rules. Try looking at the "Rules of Engagement" given to every branch of the military. The RCAF has a very good rule structure and I'm sure AVG does also. If our command says stay away from the base or no vulching or no chute shooting then we would follow those rules. The whole "this is war" crap is exactly that, a big pile of crap. We all know that in a real war their would be planes at nearby bases that could help and reinforcements behind those. It's not like these are the last 2 airbases left for the whole axis/allied side. What I'm getting at is in a real war a base would not be capped like that because someone would come to help from another nearby base. Their would be people still able to repair equipment and grab guns and continuously fire are them. If that was real then Pearl Harbor would have been just air capped the entire war. Strafing is a valid tactic but be realistic, it's not like WWII pilots flew around a base waiting for enemies to "spawn in".

Just make some rules. Better to have rules than a bunch of pissed off people who will eventually stop flying in here. As far as enforcement, try making a video and sending it in as evidence. I right click my mouse and the video starts recording. It would be very easy to take a name off the list of approved players because of continuous rule infringements. Even if they can't be enforced like you say, at least the honorable people will follow the rules and you can stop inviting the rest.

I would like to point out that during this entire campaign I never once strafed any aircraft on the ground(except Statics). I also never camped any base waiting for aircraft, granted I was strafing the static AC at the lower base, Reefer spawned in and I shot him down but I let him get in the air. That was because he was rolling in a spit, I was in a 110 and if I didn't it would have been over for me.

One more thing, no one from AVG was complaining about this when they were on the same side as RCAF

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Smokin
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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by Smokin » 03 Oct 2010 11:18

RCAF_FB_Under wrote:One more thing, no one from AVG was complaining about this when they were on the same side as RCAF
I didn't get a chance to play this one cause I was too busy, but I was there for the last campaign and I can tell you everyone on AVG complained about it, just not publicly and publicly we did try to discourage those tactics by appealing to sportsmanship and the fact that if you frustrate your opponents enough, they stop playing.

Its complicated, one one hand its a fair tactic and one that I personally don't mind employing if there is an objective that requires it like taking or defending some invading tanks near a base, or if Im in an attack bomber while attacking ground targets at a base which has no chance of out flying or out maneuvering a fighter. But its another thing entirely to have a 10 - 1 player advantage and and to position players over every base hunting for spawn-ins as a primary. I cant even dream up a way to defend that or not complain about that.

For me, as long as a player has a base to take off from and can enjoy the campaign, all's fair. If they spawn in at a base with sirens and don't opt to take off from a base that is clear of enemy, then they have no good reason to complain IMHO.
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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by RCAF_FB_Under » 03 Oct 2010 12:02

Smokin wrote:
RCAF_FB_Under wrote:One more thing, no one from AVG was complaining about this when they were on the same side as RCAF
I didn't get a chance to play this one cause I was too busy, but I was there for the last campaign and I can tell you everyone on AVG complained about it, just not publicly and publicly we did try to discourage those tactics by appealing to sportsmanship and the fact that if you frustrate your opponents enough, they stop playing..
My apology cause I didn't see or hear it.

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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by Tiger » 03 Oct 2010 19:21

S!~ Under,

That too, is complicated. We didn't feel the need to make it a public matter. We value your participation and your squadron was not violating the letter of the rules. There was a conflict with regard to SOP on take-off and landing procedures that made us less than ideal teammates for the last campaign, and both the =AVG=and RCAF are so large that they really can't be on one team. So, the problem sort of takes care of itself. The event can better handle the related issues when we're on opposing sides, as we are not teaming up to beat up on our collective guests.
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Re: Basecamping and vulching

Unread post by RCAF_FB_Blood » 04 Oct 2010 15:34

Ok to point out something. Ok yes I am not working at this given time but in the first few campains i was working and it was on a average of 80 hours a week and on call 24-7 and still managed to get on here more then some of the oter pilots and fly. Pretty sure Tiger and some of the others can remember me apoligizing for me haven to leave in a middle of a dogfight because I had to go to a rig that was blowing out, on the verge of so, or broke some of the equipent that my company I worked for supplied and I eather had to replace and or fix on site. I would still show up at pretty much any given time of day or night, but that was the perks of the job I had. And yes I do recall spawning in and finding that my base I had choosen was capped and or under attack and I still managed to get up and atleast try and do something about it rather then bitch. Most of us do this for fun or as a stress realiver or what ever and I know how it is to get in from work after driving 400 miles, working for 3 hours on a rig, coming back the same 400 miles, getting on and getting vulched. whne peaple start bitching about it then its a cop out.

Tiger sir this is only a suggestion sir, no offence ment but this may help out with future campains with new pilots. Place a post or a mass email that explains that vulching is allowed sir, that there are no true rules in the campains. ITS UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL PILOTS OR SQUADRON THAT THEY FLY WITH, ON WHAT THEY WILL AND WILL NOT DO. This may or may not help with this paticular problem sir but it give's them a heads up on what to expect. ~S~ Blood out

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